WWII Vet an illegal citizen...

[Rocky]

Yep, I said it, everyone knows drugs is Mexico's main export. All the major drug cartels are sending their drugs through Mexio into the states. I don't really care if the mexicans,latinos, or whatever come across the border, the jobs they do are jobs that most americans won't do. They are people and they gotta eat too.

Now, back to the topic at hand, which is the 95 yr old man and his citizenship. He deserves to get his citiezenship not only because of his service to our country, but also his parents were citizens of the U.S. It is just a shame that he can't prove they were actually born here.

BTW, I am not a liberal, nor a conservative. I would say that I am more on the middle of the line when it comes to politics. You, cuz, have developed quite a problem.

Besides, you apparently didn't get the sarcasm in that post.

ummmmm apparently you didnt get the fact that i was joking either? i figured i would go ahead and throw out every word that will be mentioned in this thread since it got so far off topic.

[collegetrumpet2010]

Same old bullshit, gets old, which is why I'll be limiting myself on the forum from now on to probably just my threads mainly and maybe just limiting it further. No substance, just that tired line "can't talk to you, you think you know everything" when you can't disprove anything I said or even back up what you say..lol. For the 100th time probably, I don't think I know everything, I don't at all and I'll never be close to.. But I read/research before I make posts the majority of the time in threads like this, so I know I'm right, you all twist that as to some me being cocky issue - when it's really me know what I know by looking it up beforehand and not posting claims unless I have. Some of you won't grasp it though, it'll go right over your head like most things and you'll continue to post bull/myths/misconceptions you've heard over your life and blindly accepted it as fact...so come to your own conclusions and think for yourself, then come back and talk. Call it cocky all you want, you guys just bitch and moan about me, but can't take it when I'm right - and am right because I check my facts. Here goes....

And you wonder why we bitch and moan about you.

[R13]

I just don't care anymore, same story over and over again, bring nothing to the table with the subject at hand and just babble on and on...so I'll continue to post my arguments, you all can continue to whine without posting yours.

[CoeburnCane]

Two things:

1) R13--maybe not everyone is as passionate as you are on these subjects and/or don't have the time to spend looking up links just to prove you wrong. Instead of assuming people aren't smart enough to discuss the subject on it's own merits with their own ideas instead of a link's claim, maybe you should do more discussing and learning about the other person's opinion and formulating your own instead of parrotting whatever links you can find on the subject. It's great to be a researcher--which seems like your strong point, but independent thought doesn't seem like it's your strong point...maybe you should work on that.

Remember--just because someone doesn't have 10 links to back up what they're saying doesn't mean their opinion isn't valid and substantial based solely off of their own experiences, which is what you assume and profess everytime a subject is discussed. Posting several links that sources someone smarter than you or your fellow poster doesn't mean either of you are 100% right.

2) Everyone else--I've seen a bunch of claims on several threads about some counters to what R13 posts...mostly w/o backup. Dislike the guy all you want--but R13 does his homework. Instead of complaining, maybe do more research and have supporting documentation for your arguments. That would make discussions more substantive instead of opinion-driven, and maybe we'd all learn something.

In a nutshell--R13's trying too hard like this is a life or death political debate and he HAS to win it, and the rest of you are just having a passing conversation and get pissed when someone goes into it seriously.

Maybe R13 can learn something from everyone else here, and vice-versa. IF that happens (not that I have faith that it will), maybe we can have some more constructive and civil discussions in this particular part of the forum.

[MikeJones]

CC dude Ive seen threads where he has been proven wrong time and time agiain. With facts, links etc. He still goes on like he is right and the only person that has brains on the boards.

Same old bullshit, gets old, which is why I'll be limiting myself on the forum from now on to probably just my threads mainly and maybe just limiting it further.

Ive got my fingers crossed.

[R13]

CC dude Ive seen threads where he has been proven wrong time and time agiain. With facts, links etc. He still goes on like he is right and the only person that has brains on the boards.

Go ahead and post those threads then, curious to see them.



I don't take this as serious as you all think, it's not like most of what's posted on here crosses my mind when I'm not on here. But my biggest pet-peeve is when someone says I am wrong and then doesn't tell me why I am wrong or anything to back it up...or just do it for the hell of it, when I've read up on it and know what the facts are. Anytime someone does that and takes the time to chime in saying I'm wrong, then I expect them to tell me why, it's just a cop-out to me when they don't and it happens 90% of the time with the "there's no arguing with you, you know it all". If I'm so blatantly wrong, then it should be easy to prove it, yet that never happens.

Most of what's posted isn't some matter of opinion that's left up to interpretation, it's not like someone is saying "spicy food upsets my stomach" and I'm posting links saying "nooooo, it's something else", these are things that are either one way or the other with little gray area...this last issue discussed wasn't an opinion issue, it doesn't matter if people are using strictly opinion as facts, if it's wrong it's wrong. My opinions are not "parroting" what some link says, I just base my opinions on as much facts/truth as I can, because I think the number one problem with this country and hell even the world are people basing an entire viewpoint on what they've always heard or misinformed generalizations about things...then they bring that to the polling place and it fucks us all. Another pet peeve, people who base their entire world view on highschool rumor level rhetoric that they soak up as facts because it sounds nice or what they heard at the dinner table growing up and just accepted it as truth...in any area, I think that shows a real lack of substance - which is yet another pet peeve when someone is uninteresting, generic and can't think for themselves. Not saying that's everyone on here or really directed towards anyone, just see it too much in the world.

I know I seem to get fired up in these threads, but really everything is left at the computer and I know it's a forum on the damn internet. Still, when you have worked with campaigns and hear so many people who are so clueless about everything and think that these people have so much control with their vote...it makes you sick to your stomach and you can't say what you want to either. But what you learn is that misinformation and misconceptions about issues like immigration or ANYTHING can effect a lot of people - hurt a lot of people, so you want to correct it. That's why I get annoyed because it's pretty common in several posters, then when they say I'm the one wrong, I get even more annoyed. It's not a cocky issue about being wrong, I've been wrong and will be wrong about a lot of things in life, but it looks pretty lame to me when you can't tell me what's wrong with what I said but wrong a paragraph/took the time to say I was especially when I know I was actually right because I've read about it months ago and just rechecked it twice before I posted.

[CoeburnCane]

All I'm saying is ease up a bit and listen more. You bring up an article, ask a question on it. You get 3-4 responses that are counter to your thought on the question/subject, and them bam-bam-bam-bam, you're on them like a lion on raw meat with a bunch of links and "I'm right, you're flat wrong--I've researched this to death"...when all they have is a reactive opinion on the face of it and you've already prepped for it like it's the State of the Union. That's more than a little messed up, and unfair to other posters--and your reaction to their base opinion is a turnoff for anyone to waste the time to find facts that support their opinion/argument b/c they know you WILL NOT listen...because you haven't yet, and that's from post #1 to post #9,812--trust me, I've seen 90+% of your posts.

You keep talking about folks not proving you wrong...well, when have you ever honestly listened to someone else's opinion, seen facts from the other side, and seen the other POV? Find me those links, and I'll get off your case...

And one more thing so you know I'm not just being a prick--I 100% agree with your assertion that people use their knee-jerk reactions more often than actually being well-read and studied up on subjects that affect us all. One of my favorite folks on any network news broadcast is Rachel Maddow b/c she's all about making sure her facts are checked, double-checked, and triple-checked. Even if you don't agree with something she says idealogically, you can't refute the facts she uses. I understand that's part of your motivation for being so well-prepared coming into any thread that you start and/or most of the hot button topics out there. Not everyone is as dedicated to that as you are, and to expect as much is short-sided, even ignorant, on your part.

Listen up and listen good to this tidbit of wisdom--people, collectively, are dumb. Some individuals are smart, but a lot of the political agendas and opinions are based off of those of the masses...which is a collection of people, and is thusly dumb more often than it is intelligent. You force-feeding your researched facts down their throats on here will not make them any less dumb. You're fighting a good yet futile fight. That's a pessimistic, but realistic lesson that you need to grasp onto sooner than later. You'll be less frustrated with your fellow man as a result.

[Rocky]

You're fighting a good yet futile fight. That's a pessimistic, but realistic lesson that you need to grasp onto sooner than later. You'll be less frustrated with your fellow man as a result.

i wish i could thank just that one part........... very well said and this is what i have tried to get through on several occasions, just because someone doesnt agree with you, it DOES NOT make them stupid or uneducated.

and FWIW R13 the only time i ever thought you were really WRONG on something was with the dream act discussion we had. you said there were no funds set aside for them (pell grant or other) and you were wrong on that, they actually had MORE money allocated to them than what pell grants were offering to students with less funds. besides that, i really cant say that ive ever seen something yous aid that was totally wrong, just WAYYYYY biased. and you argue over stupid shit. but this is like my 5th post in 3 months so what do i know, i dont really like this place anymore anyway

[MikeJones]

Go ahead and post those threads then, curious to see them.

Yeh right. I can barley stand reading your post's in current threads. Im not diggin through your BS

[collegetrumpet2010]

It's not so much that anybody thinks you are wrong. My beef is that you come across as if you're always right and that everyone else here is stupid for disagreeing.